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A Proposal on Documented Game Data
Goosio
Posts: 71Member Beginner
Per the advice of CadillacShrimpin and quite a few others, many of us undertook to document our possession and levels/skill ranks/etc. in a combination of both screenshots and video recordings. Putting aside the questionable choice of resetting UWO's past seven years of progress back to square one, which I do not agree with and feel is a terrible mistake which could still be averted to some degree, Vertigo apparently prides themselves on being a company that will put users first, consistently reaching out to their gaming communities and keeping communication open.
In that spirit, I would suggest then that players who preserved their data in the manner I just mentioned could request a restoration of lost items/levels/etc., so long as they could provide proof of their claims. This step would not help those who were away from the game during its final days and were unable to document their data as well, but it would soften much of the proposed lost content from a total server wipe, and might go a long way to smoothing over relations with a player base that, at this moment in time, is feeling hurt and betrayed, by showing that Vertigo is indeed paying attention to our concerns and wants to work with us to keep UWO a fun and great place to play.
I will also be contacting Vertigo directly through its other channels mentioned here: https://www.gamasutra.com/view/pressreleases/306350/UNCHARTED_WATERS_ONLINE_SETTING_SAIL_FOR_PAPAYA_PLAY.php
But because they have also said to feel free to share any discussions, suggestions or ideas on the forum with other users and their Uncharted Waters Support Team, who (reportedly) will be more than happy to listen to us regarding our game experiences
and feedback in order to improve user experience and the community, I am posting this suggestion here as well, even knowing there'll be those who disagree with it.
I do too, actually. The server ought to have been preserved and transferred as smoothly as it was in the past! But alas. It was not, and so here we are. Whatever role OGPlanet may have played in this, the ball is now in Vertigo's court. How they choose to continue to play this game, time along will tell.
In that spirit, I would suggest then that players who preserved their data in the manner I just mentioned could request a restoration of lost items/levels/etc., so long as they could provide proof of their claims. This step would not help those who were away from the game during its final days and were unable to document their data as well, but it would soften much of the proposed lost content from a total server wipe, and might go a long way to smoothing over relations with a player base that, at this moment in time, is feeling hurt and betrayed, by showing that Vertigo is indeed paying attention to our concerns and wants to work with us to keep UWO a fun and great place to play.
I will also be contacting Vertigo directly through its other channels mentioned here: https://www.gamasutra.com/view/pressreleases/306350/UNCHARTED_WATERS_ONLINE_SETTING_SAIL_FOR_PAPAYA_PLAY.php
But because they have also said to feel free to share any discussions, suggestions or ideas on the forum with other users and their Uncharted Waters Support Team, who (reportedly) will be more than happy to listen to us regarding our game experiences
and feedback in order to improve user experience and the community, I am posting this suggestion here as well, even knowing there'll be those who disagree with it.
I do too, actually. The server ought to have been preserved and transferred as smoothly as it was in the past! But alas. It was not, and so here we are. Whatever role OGPlanet may have played in this, the ball is now in Vertigo's court. How they choose to continue to play this game, time along will tell.
Comments
There was so much wealth in the server, they had to get rid of it, to ensure that we struggle once again unless we drop hundreds or even thousands more dollars. Jokes on them though, cuz I'm free rolling.
Highly unlikely pretty much impossible who's to say that people didn't just take a pic of a ROG SS it then pass to another alt and repeat then claim hey restore my 5 ROGS please. Not going to happen now as Caddy said a SS would prove you owned an item if you lost it because then provider would have a record of all trades, transactions and Item IDs HOWEVER in the case of a Server reset it's null and void as there are NO RECORDS of any transactions or item records as there is no way to prove you in fact owned anything
Basically as Papaya said as of Sept 29 OGP erased or removed all the server data so it's gone for good so basically all of this opposition is sadly too little too late it should have been done as soon as OGP announced closure and pressure being applied to them until they spilled the beans on if a wipe was occurring or not but...many didn't do that because <gasps> its "drama" if you try to protect your investment...smh
I can totally see that.
WE want a definite statement why this server wipe is going on.
More over, it's not impossible to pull game items out of the database and deliver them to players; levels and skills could also be recreated, in many cases down to the exact numbers. Possession is 9/10ths of the law in many cases, and a picture's worth a thousand words. The database would've made it a simpler process, but I don't see it as being an impossible task with the evidence at our disposal.
And like Sundogg97, I also don't really feel the data issues were explained as fully as they could could have been, either. The only statement made so far was extremely vague, and doesn't actually explain very much at all. A more in-depth and thorough explanation would be much more helpful than what sparse information has been given so far. Neither do I see any problem with the current opposition; I'm actually surprised you've given up so easily, considering how hard and long you've fought for things in the past. It's your call to make, of course, but I will be continuing on to the end.
And as much as I hate OGP, think they're a bunch of lowlife pieces of
garbage who killed UWO while squeezing every penny they could out of us
through the cash shop with no care at all for the game, and would love
to point another finger at them for something... I highly doubt at the last second OGP unexpectedly wiped all the character data if that was originally supposed to be part of the deal and Vertigo was just cool with that.
The only thing that makes sense to me is this...
1. Vertigo knew they were going to wipe the server from the get-go. You don't just go into licensing an MMO (the great expense, the staffing, the resources) without extensive research into the game (gameplay, game engine, server architecture, and a PLAN). There is no way. And there is no way I'm believing that Vertigo expected to get all the character data, OGP made some kind of derp move and deleted it all by accident, and Vertigo just proceeded with the buy like that would be acceptable. If Vertigo didn't get the character data, it was never part of the deal to begin with. Don't be naive.
2. OGP knowing this wipe was coming stipulated non-disclosure of that plan until after the sale. Why? Because if we all knew a wipe was coming, instead of spending our remaining astros and worrying about getting all of our stuff out of the captain's chest like a bunch of idiots, we would have been on the phone with our banks trying to get refunds for whatever astros we had left. You notice they did fulfill was was likely their legal obligation to make us aware that we could do that. Guessing not many people did though. Had we been told a wipe was coming I'm guessing that would have played out a little differently.
And so, Vertigo stays quiet till after the sale. And OGP gets to securely finish milking us right up to the bitter end, without much (if any) refunds to worry about.
No other scenario make any logical sense... to me anyway.
And for the record it kills me, the blatant disrespect we have been shown. Not only the years and years of painstaking progress, all the money we spent, sticking by our beloved UWO through thick and thin. All just wiped away. But the utter disregard for any common human decency to even let us know what was going on until after the fact.
Games change hands, servers get wiped. It sucks, it's out of our control, but I get it. It happens. But the way this all went down is total bullshit.
For all we know, OGP made an offer, were rebuffed by Papaya who thought they could pull a second La Tale, but OGP may have kept the data a bit longer in order to come back to them once news of the wipe broke and say, "So, about that game data you said you didn't want to buy..." This also is speculation, though given OGP's history, it sounds like something they'd do, even after closing down their public spaces and sites.
Really, we still don't have enough information on the state of the data or the deals which were made, and data recovery, particularly through backups, isn't an impossibility in most cases either. I would also point to past contest winners whose achivements were recorded on Facebook, and through correspondence to OGP via emails (in turn provably linked to account data). Could they not also just request Vertigo replace their lost rewards from those times? It doesn't seem an impossible request.
That seems like it would be much easier to prove, but so far, I know of no efforts made to try and replace those lost contest/race rewards. I also want to know how exactly our login details were able to survive the transfer without incident, since I would've thought they'd be as intricately tied to the game server data as our characters and possessions. How exactly can there be a tiered compensation plan, if details on how long our accounts existed (implied by use of the word "tiered") managed to survive, yet nothing else did? The continuing public silence of Papaya/Vertigo in all of this is deafening, and not helping matters in the slightest.
But for me, there is no compensation package big enough to stick around any longer after a total server wipe. The community that I loved is on the verge of dying out, my achievements/possessions are potentially gone for good (each of them happy milestones and mementos of my time spent enjoying UWO, more than trophies to lord over others, or to equip for boosts to skills and speed), and a very bad precedent has now been set that means any progress I might make could be lost again just as easily, even assuming UWO survives this catastrophic transfer which has cut out the vital organs that helped it to function for seven whole years.
That is why, come what may, I fight. I see no future for UWO otherwise.
LJ: Rebalancing and revamping battles would have been possible to do without a total wipe. In fact, most of the existing infrastructure would've helped players new and old to dive right into it. Not so much now, of course. If it was all to make a speedy deadline, then that's a pity, and not a very good business move.
I do not believe that OGP wiped the data. As I was reading that notice about OGP losing data, I was thinking it was a bunch of bullshit before I had read the entirety of that message.
A transfer such as this includes contracts. If OGP wiped the data in violation of a contract, they would be forced, by law, to pay compensation to Vertigo.
This was a stinker from both sides. OGP continued to accept money after they knew they were going to sell, and Vertigo blames OGP for what Vertigo has done. Typical corporate bullshit.
I agree about Papaya not keeping us informed but we are NOT EVEN about to act like OGP is innocent in all this and played no part in this at all. Let me tell you why I think OGP played a substantial role.
1. Shut down entire game with NO WARNING in 7 days . who in the hell shuts down an entire business in 7 days that's not even enough time to fully clean out file cabinets let alone alone back up servers send to provider discuss terms of transfer etc...He'll you have to give 2 weeks notice when you quit a job they didn't even give that.
2. OGP lied and said the game was fine and they plan to support the game for a long time then all of sudden we closing in 7days?! really that's not suspicious at all...
3. When notice of closure was announced they didn't say sh** after that. NOTHING about our data being safe not answering tickets forums or anything DEAD SILENCE. Nothing suspicious there...I mean definitely Papaya dropped the ball on keeping us informed too I already voiced my displeasure to them about that but...At least they said something OGP didn't say a god damn thing literally nothing.
4. They never said anything about saving our data. For a company supporting us 4 freaking years they couldn't at least tell us that?!
listen hate Papaya all you want guys but to act like OGP is innocent in all this is being Naive as hell . They are the ONLY ones not here now answering questions about their product that they SWORE to protect in their TOS that's a huge red flag for me even more than Papaya they left very quickly and very secretively don't ever forget that.
Damn Frozen you are taking a beating in the dislikes got damn babes lol.
But anyways I'm just keeping it real it's baffling how people could simply just not even consider OGP screwed us regarding proper handoff of this game or possibly trying to extort Papaya for an unrealistic amount of money for server data when they did SOOOOOOO much shady crap that I listed above. it's mind boggling...but hey if they want to solely blame Papaya more power to you but if ppl think OGP had our back at all regarding preserving server data after all the crap they pulled in those 7 days until closure then they must be smoking . After them hiring a Player GM and a Ban spree then now a 7 day notification of the business closing down and keeping it secret to milk us for cash I don't put a DAMN THING passed OGP thier treachery knows NO BOUNDS.
We don't really know what was given could be just names to give founder rewards. Also where does it say awards will be based on levels?
Anywho the only way to solve this mystery that could refute Papaya's claim that the legacy sever data is gone is if 1 or more of the following happens below....
1. OGP themselves saying we gave Papaya the FULL server data what they did with it is up to them... Would prove Papaya lied
2. OGP themselves saying That Full server transfer was NOT in the agreement between us and Papaya... Would prove Papaya lied
3. Papaya suddenly mysteriously "finds" the legacy server data and decides to restore data and not wipe... This will prove they lied about it if they do this.
4. OGP themselves state yes we deleted the server data or yes we did Not turn over data to Papaya
5. OGP states Papaya never asked for server data so we never gave it. Would prove Papaya lied.
Unless one of these 5 outcomes happens we have no choice but to believe Papaya. Since those douchebags in OGP are no longer in business and didn't tell us a damn thing when they were OPEN despite us asking them ... I Highly doubt we can prove Papaya ever had the server data from OGP. That's straight uncut Realness... Take it how you want and judging by OGP history, lies, actions and silence I'm not clearing them of any wrong doing. SIMPLE
At this point I'd say the scenario envisioned by ConcernedTraveler is looking more likely, that both companies made a legally binding agreement with zero misunderstandings of what it entailed, and collectively acted against the users -- OGP by robbing us one last time, Vertigo by choosing not to implement a full server transfer for whatever reasons (the prevailing theory is 'greed so everyone will buy their money shop items to restart').
I came to expect that kind of behavior from OGP, but if this is how Vertigo plans to start their stewardship of UWO, it bodes very poorly for the game's future. And the lack of concrete information on all these backroom deals is the reason why things appear to us the way they do now, as there has been little to nothing to contradict it. Even putting that all aside, there's still the question of the server data backups.
Now, those kinds of backups would've been needed to help ensure the game didn't die out completely while it was being hosted by OGPlanet; glitches happen, and backups mean you can get back up to speed as quick as possible with minimum loss/fuss. Likewise, most backups would be stored for long periods of time; a month to six months is the usual industry standard, and typically a part of business contracts. OGP destroying that data had they agreed to hand it over as part of the transfer would've landed them in legal hot water with Vertigo, and KOEI-Tecmo; we'd have heard about it, and Vertigo would've been quick to blame them specifically for this act.
Instead, no apparent legal actions being taken. Sadly, that lends credence to the theory that Vertigo hoped to pull a server wipe without being blamed for it. But that data... would it have all been destroyed so quickly? It would've been a lot of information to go over, and even with a fresh install of the game data, there's always the possibility Vertigo might've needed access to the old data for something unforeseen, at least up to and a bit after relaunch.
There's also the matter that those types of data backups could have been copied and sent to KOEI-Tecmo to help locate bugs for troubleshooting, or working out patch details. Who's to say the data might not still be in their possession somewhere, easily accessed if it was really needed?
As well, KOEI-Tecmo could just as easily weigh in on the matter in place of OGP; I find it hard to believe that they wouldn't have some idea of what exactly was going on here. UWO is their IP, and lawyers are sticklers about paperwork and legal trails concerning such things. I don't want to believe any of this is true of Vertigo, but they've given us very little reason to think otherwise at this point. I'll look forward to hearing what KOEI-Tecmo and Vertigo have to say in their emails, if they indeed plan to say anything at all.
I do notice there's been no shooting down of the "past event winners who are on record could be compensated again by Vertigo if provable" idea, though. Interesting. Silence is complicity, so full steam ahead trying to get back your event rewards, players from past events who were acknowledged on Facebook and may also have emails from OGP confirming distribution to characters kept on your account!
In fact, while the counter-arguments against my proposal and others have been very interesting so far, none of them have actually come from officially licensed and employed Vertigo/Papaya staff members, or their UWO team. Let's hear it straight from the horses' mouth what they are or are not willing/able to do; whether or not they're willing to listen to the people warning them against a complete wipe, and work with those who've supported, nurtured, and loved this game for 7+ years of their lives, and who have a far greater understanding of it than them.
Before news of the reset came, people were lining up with resumes and offers to reach out and help; the lack of response/interaction, coupled with the apparent inevitability of this move, is only making the users feel more and more unwanted. And who would stick around in an abusive relationship where they're only wanted for the money they might contribute to the hosts? Some, perhaps, but not all of us. Not even a majority, I'm afraid.
We are watching and waiting to hear from you, Vertigo/Papaya. You can be heroes and try to salvage this growing PR nightmare which threatens to depopulate the very game you wish to host, or you can continue to remain silent, and watch as the community dwindles, and the game itself suffers along with you. We of the UWO loved this game dearly, and cherished it; we had to have, if we spent all these years building it up, supporting it, investing thousands of dollars and countless hours into it. The ball is firmly in your court. How you choose to play this from here on out will decide the future of UWO.