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Ship Rebuilding - Getting High Performance

demonwrathdemonwrath Posts: 10Member Beginner
General Discussion
When I rebuild my ship with say "wave resistance improvement" I only get +7 or +9 resistance with maxed out ship handling proficiency on that particular ship.
And I can't add the improvement anymore (Like if I added it at g0-g1, then I can't add it at g2-g3)

So.. I only get a little bit of performance improvement.
And my ship rebuilding skill is r12 - not sure if higher makes the "performances" higher during rebuilding?

But the thing is... I see other ships who got like +30 and +40 on different Performance skills.

How do they get so high performances, when rebuilding only gives me like +4 or +9 ?

Also another thing I'm confused about... during the rebuilding process, do the mat ships need to have high "Ship Handling Proficiency" or is it fine that they are just 0 ?

Thank you for your help

Comments

  • theedgedemontheedgedemon Posts: 237Member Trainee
    first i feel very sad for that poor ship you  graded with WR, may he rest in scraps...

    second, you should use SSIPs and improvement parts for getting high performance in any stat, the grading option is a relic of a sad past when we were limited on how much we could mod our ships, i would try to consult a high rank SB before continuing your mod, or read Cadillac guide, which is admittedly outdated but still a good start.

    disclaimer you don't need to give your ship to the SB for modding, and if you do make sure its a sb you can trust.

    demonwrath
    Desire spawns madness, madness collapses into disaster.
    mankind never learns...
  • WhitejacketWhitejacket Posts: 87Member Beginner

    Hi - I'm a rank 20 shipbuilder; I'll give you a (quick) response here.

    When grading, you only get a "perk" at G1, G3, and G6. You also cannot get the same perk twice. This is why you won't see "wave resistant improvement" a second time. When you use a perk like "wave resistance improvement" you usually won't get the entire bonus anyway. 

    When you "mod" a ship, you can improve any of the base stats depending on the parts you use. There can be three outcomes of this process: a success (normal) a great success (above average) and a fail (lowest possible improvement). So if you are modding your ship and you use, say, a part that gives +2 to +4 turn, a +3 would be a success, a +4 would be a great success, and a +2 would be a fail. The higher your shipbuilding skill, the better the chance of a great success.

    The reason why you see such great stats on ships now ifs because they can be "overmodded." Basically, most ship have 5 mods that you can do (which can be upgraded to 6 in some cases at a colony's shipyard). You can now attempt to maximize your performance by going beyond the mod limit for a ship, but the costs get higher and higher as you go and if you do not use cash parts, you are not guaranteed that the mod will work at all, and you will lose the SSIPs and parts if this happens. If the mod does work, then there is still the chance of a fail/success/great success.

    Because of this overmodding process, it's not usually a good idea to use some of the "perks" when grading to your main ship (perks such as wr improvement, turn, etc.), because they can simply be added when modding/overmodding. These perks still come in handy for aide ships.

    When grading, having the mat ship at 100% proficiency helps a bit with the grading percentage. Using the EXACT same ship boosts the % much higher (e.g. big trading carrack into big trading carrack - a trading carrack into a big trading carrack is not the same type of ship) and using the exact same may ship at least one grade higher works wonders for the %.

    Lastly, be aware that grading a ship at G4 or higher has the possibility of a FAILED grade, meaning your ship will actually go back a grade. There are techniques to improve on the %, but just keep it in mind for now.

    There are a few shipbuilding guides out there, but we warned they are long and somewhat hard to follow at times. Practice helps a lot. In addition, some info will be changed somewhat due to the recent change in the shipbuilding rules, but the guides will still give you a good idea overall. I found the guide by Kubrius to be particularly helpful when I started out. The guide by Tamandaré also gives some help.

    Again, remember that some things have changed. Hope this helps.


    demonwrath
    IGN: Milvio, Caroline, and Nasrin
  • WhitejacketWhitejacket Posts: 87Member Beginner
    One other point. When grading, if you have access to a colony's r3 shipyard, this increases the % by (I think) 20%. It might be 15% or 10%, but either way, it's another boost. So if you have to do heavy duty grading, try to find such a colony shipyard. Not all ships will be available, but the % gained doing it there should offset any % lost when grading in a different ship.
    demonwrath
    IGN: Milvio, Caroline, and Nasrin
  • theedgedemontheedgedemon Posts: 237Member Trainee
    @Whitejacket 
     not a bad answer however this is fake " you will lose the SSIPs and parts if this happens" you will not lose youre SSIPs, only the ship parts, and that's an important difference because SSIPs are the biggest cost of any improvement.
    demonwrath
    Desire spawns madness, madness collapses into disaster.
    mankind never learns...
  • WhitejacketWhitejacket Posts: 87Member Beginner

    Thanks for the correction. I admit I did not test out that aspect myself; a (almost 100% apparently) reliable source told me in-game that the SSIPs would be lost, but it's great that they are not.

    When I post-modded, I used cash parts on every mod, so the level was at 100% success. Not using the cash part(s) the level dropped to about 70% or so at some point, but I didn't want to take the chance on losing those parts.


    demonwrath
    IGN: Milvio, Caroline, and Nasrin
  • demonwrathdemonwrath Posts: 10Member Beginner

    Thanks for clearing up the performance confusion. Didn't know about SSIP, Modding, etc
    Also really glad to hear that the SSIPs don't poof if you fail during modding! 
    And Aye - the WR ship I was making is RIP *salute*

    Thank you for the very in-depth answer! 
    Your answer and the links helps a lot in understanding the factors related to improving performance and I'll have to look into finding a company with a r3 shipyard most definitely!

    ==========================

    Couple extra questions related to shipbuilding

    1.) For a row galley with 0/5 improvements, would "Row Improvement" also be a waste in your opinion like Wave Resist? 

    i.e.
    (Row Improvement, Ship Speed Up 1, 2) < or > than (Ship Speed Up 1, 2, 3) ?

    I just remember reading some guide that says Row Improvement not only adds Row Power buts boosts Ship Speed also? 
    But maybe they don't know what they were talking about or that guide was old.

    2.) How much is the current market price in gold for SSIP's? 50m per?

    3.) I was interested in building an Assault Ottoman Galley, however when I consulted this site ( https://uwo-hq.blogspot.com/2018/03/assault-ottoman-galley.html ) the places it said where you go to build it, I didn't see the ship listed at the shipbuilder in any of the cities where it says to go? 
    (Istanbul, Alexandria, Algiers)

    Thank you for your help!!!
    Whitejacket
  • carlalexcarlalex Posts: 187Member Trainee
    Some ships only become available after you invest in the port and/or the port gets developed enough.
  • theedgedemontheedgedemon Posts: 237Member Trainee
     1) yes definitely a waste remember you can now "over mod" essentially to infinite so it may cost you 20 mods or so but you can technically have all stats maxed with SSIPs, now that is something you will only want to do to mid-high end ships but since order of the prince: ssu1,2,3 or inherit/extra slot + ssu1,2 > row + ssu1,2 since that row grade could be easily replaced with like 600m in SSIPs, and instead reduces a bit of the final potential you could have. 
     should be second but row power increases sails as a multiplier with your rowing skill, i don't remember the exact numbers  but i think a maxed row + maxed row skill was something like sails x 2. 

    2) current price in ducats is about 30m it could go down if the market is flooded and up if they are out of tickets but now is around that value.

    3) as @carlalex said some ships can only be build by investing on the port first, in the case of AOG it need invest in territory ports, and while there is a method to invest in 2 of those its not easy to accomplish so you would do better finding a SB with 7 nations or straight up Ottoman to build you one, if you do, make sure you pay the extra 50m or so to get it made with an official hull because that means more dura and a nice green color with very little cost.

    players are generally nice in the game so if you ask for some minutes you should be able to find someone to help you with that.
    WhitejacketCulvern
    Desire spawns madness, madness collapses into disaster.
    mankind never learns...
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