[PvP Trial Period] Unlimited Battles on Seas! (Closed)

JamesHart2

Damn you Culvern you actually said something I have to agree with :p 

viennas

@purplepirate

it's pointless to read your posts. Ironically are the stupidest always the ''loudest & smartest.''But you and your kind have get what you wanted, turn this game into a brainless PK game.Congratulations, bravo,..enjoy it,..now your kind will farm each other, since there won't be no one else left, the self fulfilling prophecy.

ccsray88

I am against this "Unlimited Battles on Seas". I can only see this benefit the pirate players, what about those players who are traders and adventurer? This is too much, reducing the time for repeat hitting the same player from 24hrs to 1hrs and I already seem pirate tailing for re-hit when I sail from EA back to euro. To totally removal the timer will surely bring farming back, pirates will keep attacking the same player even if there is no more cash or cargo to plunder, the pirate can still hope for item plunder or what so ever reason they have, there is no risk of the pirate losing as trader/adv player with it tiny crew and low battle skill will never win, pirate can stay on farming the same player for a rather long time as a damaged ship will take more time to reach a port. I do recall hearing stories of pirates farming their own alt toons to turn the sea hostile during early days, removal of the timer will likely bring this back.

Thinking about “Weather Phenomena”, those discoveries at sea that need time and patience, how can adventurer stop their ship at the spot to wait for the phenomena to appear when pirate is able to appear anytime and farm the waiting adventurer. Using of large tribute will only buy a few minutes while phenomena often take far more time than that to appear. Same problem will appear on charting and pulling shipwrecks where player need to stay in the same water doing it, a pirate which can continuously attack and farm which force the player to abandon the effort.

We are already facing low population problem since the reset, this removal of timer I fear will cause players who prefer just to trade and do quest to quit. Tribute can only get us a few minutes, not much if the player is in a slow ship out in the deep ocean. Blue flag will cost uwo credit which not many can afford or keep buying. Yes, we can stay in safe water like pirate always say, so that mean hostile water will be empty and nothing for pirate to hunt, they will quit, while non pirate player forced to stay most of the time in the limited safe waters will quickly find it boring and quit. End up this game will just keep lose player.

Reset didn’t cause me to consider quitting this game, but this decision to removal the timer for the first time make me consider it. I be hunting another trading/adventure game if this is a perm decision. Make no sense to me to continue spend my money in a game that I cannot enjoy anymore. Pirates are part of this game but please also listen to the voice of traders and adventurers.

chronofox

I think people for get that pirates have a huge tie in to trade in terms of crafting sells.gear wps ship parts fsparts cannons  tribs.

pvp/piracy has been part of the game from day 1 and at one point was overly nerfed in to the ground.

And did other forget that pilage orders dont work in pvp any more in less there fixing that as well u are going to lose about the same amount of cargo as u do now per hit.


I see the same point tring to be made about how they think this is making them have to pay real $$ its kind of funny.

people can farm quest craft and dungeons in eu to make $$ if they want a blue flag that badly.

The real prob for them is not that it is they need 3 blue flags and im guess thats why they are crying so much on this.


This will help crafting sells a lot .Look the best times to sell for the longest time was around a esf pvp.

purplepirate

@ccsray88 Thinking about “Weather Phenomena”, those discoveries at sea that need
time and patience, how can adventurer stop their ship at the spot to
wait for the phenomena to appear when pirate is able to appear anytime
and farm the waiting adventurer. Using of large tribute will only buy a
few minutes while phenomena often take far more time than that to
appear. Same problem will appear on charting and pulling shipwrecks
where player need to stay in the same water doing it, a pirate which can
continuously attack and farm which force the player to abandon the
effort.

well these are the times you would use a blue flag. While i can agree that unrestricted farming without some balancing factor is to much i can see this as a strategy for papaya to make more revenue. A blue flag only costs $1.50 for a full day's protection and since you've admitted that you spend money on the server, then why can't you just use some of your spending for some of those? Then you wouldn't even care if there's pirates or not. For people who do spend on the server this is just small budgeting change. As for those who can't buy uwc, they can easily get blue flags in game on merchant chat by shouting WTB. Also, i'm sure Papaya will be giving alot away in the future in login and/or daily bonus quest rewards, it would be foolish of them to take this course and not provide some form of partial protection.

  You know between us and all the Asian servers, we're the only ones that aren't subscription base. We are lucky to be able to play for free like that, like you said not everyone can buy uwc so if this server forced everyone to pay a monthly fee to play i think this game would have even less people playing it because it's so old. Using a few blue flags to play without worry i think is a small and fair request on Papaya's part.

BengalTiger777

The following is a copy and paste of my response to the Facebook group administered by WalkerDePlank.  I have modified the paragraphs to make it easier to read:

Don't they still have level 30 in one class, level 50 total, 80 level difference protection? I would propose that KOEI do away with the level 30 and level 50 protection, but increase the differential to possibly 100 total levels. 

Also, I would ask KOEI to consider allowing the Black Sea and Canary Islands the ability to go safe or lawless. As an incentive for non-maritimers to sail in hostile/lawless waters, ducat, xp, and fame rewards for quest completion would be set as follows: 

Europe and non-European safe waters: 1/2 normal multiplier

hostile waters: 1.5 x normal multiplier

non-EA lawless waters: 2x normal multiplier (EA when hostile would be 2x and then 3x when lawless to compensate for the additional risk of transporting high value Nanban goods)

I am not a pirate; however, I would like to work toward a fair resolution for adventurers, traders, PvE maritimers, and PvP maritimers.

I look forward to your replies.  I wish you fair winds and following seas.

DanielFreedomHunters

To add to the list of old NetMarble "noobs" from back when.   I was one of those, low level whites who got repeatedly farmed.   And yes it makes you hate all "rats" but, it also makes you want to level your fighting skills and get a decent ship.   

On the positive side, I do remember having real fleets that traveled in packs for safety.  And I am not talking about 2 players and 3 alts.   I am talking 4-5 players going to the spice islands or slipping in Calicut.  And to the Purple Pirates point, we used to take one Fighter with us, and split the profits when we got back.  We need more reasons for players to work together. 

The game was better back then.  You had to pay attention to what you are doing.  You could not auto-nav, every place you went.   Like right now, I am sailing back from Cape Town, typing this.  If I had to worry about being hit, I would not have my game window covered with this.  

Also, there has not been a point of making tributes or selling them in years.  It could be a way to for Merchants to make some money producing them. 

My only concern, as many have listed, is there has to be limit on the number of times a white can be hit in a row.  I think the 5 plunders and return to pirate base, is a good start.   But "Rats" travel in packs too.  As I sit here in my rocking chair telling old stories, I remember, getting whacked by 2 or 3 different pirates traveling together.  Before, I could replace my crew after the first "stern" kicking, I got hit again and again.  That got old really fast.  (It still does, when it happens in ESF.  You lose your crew and you cannot limp back to port without being road kill, for those vultures who do not want a challenge and, just run up the score up.)  

This might be a good compromise.  If a white gets plundered, the solid green flag is given for 5 minutes.  After the 5 minutes, the green flag blinks off and on for the next 55 minutes.  The white can be attacked with a flashing green flag, but if they lose again, it stays solid green for an extra 5 minutes, for every time they are plundered.  The white can still only get hit 5 times in a hour, but they cannot get farmed 5 times in 30 minutes.  (First loss 5 minutes. Second loss 10 minutes. Third loss 15 minutes.  Forth loss, 20 minutes.  So if you get attacked a 5th time it was at least 50 minutes since you got attacked the first time.) 

InfamousKilla

It seems like many of you weren't even paying attention. The cooldown if u lose is 10 minutes. If you lost in lawless then 5 minutes.

theedgedemon

"It seems like many of you weren't even paying attention. The cooldown if u lose is 10 minutes. If you lost in lawless then 5 minutes."

it would be a shame if someone could farm own his alt to make any sea lawless wouldn't it?

purplepirate

@theedgedemon it would be a shame if someone could farm own his alt to make any sea lawless wouldn't it?

  It's a shame that a few people who insist on 'bending' the rules ruins it for everyone else. One modification they should make is about attacking your own ip/s accounts.

InfamousKilla

Couldn't you do the same to make waters safe, by farming your pirate alt? I don't see the issue as being 1 sided, it's a loophole PapayaPlay should get fixed. I feel like notoriety should represent the players you kill, but killing your own nation's NPC will give you essentially free Notoriety. This aspect makes pirate contests pointless, unless contests count player kills only by tracking the log in the maritime guild, which by the way seems incredibly difficult.

JeanPaulDupleix

Before i get to the topic I would like to ask Papaya to publish game details + previews also here on their own server and not exclusively on facebook. I dont have an account there and wont register one. Thank you

Many players have already rightly remarked that this rule, if made permanent, is going to drive people who dont like PvP away from UWO so i dont need to go into details on that.

Zakari1967 has already referred to the Terms of Service (7. f) and i add a quote from  "7. USER CONDUCT (n)" here:

"You agree not to take any of the following actions:.....(n)Take any action that may prohibit other users from enjoying the services of the Website or games"

This means that strictly speaking any pirate attacks on players are only in accordance with the ToS as long as the attacked is still enjoying the game.

The best and cleanest solution in accordance with the ToS would be a tick box "allow pirate attacks" like we have for mock battles. And unless the box is ticked the player cant be attacked or attack. Then pirates could attack those who agree to it and those who dont want to get into PvP have the option simply not allow it.

Then everybody could select the option s/he wants: PvP or PvP-free and all be happy and enjoy the game in the style they like.

As long as we dont have such a button we do need blue flags and fine tributes that give us a sufficient protection from PvP players enforcing their play style on players like me who dont want PvP battles.

The 1 hour rule was good and effective to prevent farming and should be kept.

For the duration of the trial I will just stay in Europe and I suggest that all other players who oppose the new rule also do that.

Let us give a realistic simulation and demonstration of what the seas will look like if frequently repeated attacks on players are allowed.

For players who think that UWO needs more PvP to be enjoyable I have a suggestion:

If you want to have an exciting game and a challenge as a maritimer why not look into Battle Campaigns for possible enhancments of your game experience. Here you could meet like minded PvPers and challenge each other.

Piracy is ambushing the unprepared and thus should be far too boring for players who look for excitement or consider themselves good maritimers.

So why do we keep discussing piracy and how it can be changed? 

Why not think about real challenges for PvP players, where both parties are prepared and a challenge for each other. My guess offhand is that Battle Campaigns could be such a field. But I will leave that to the PvP enthusiasts. It is for them to say what they enjoy.

All I am saying is that I am not having PvP players enforce their style on me and that there have to be effective ways of protecting myself as a player from unwanted pirate attacks.

Please let us all think about ways that we can improve this game without enforcing our own play-style on others. UWO is big enough a world to house both PvP and PvE players.

ps: correction to the original post: North Atlantic is permanently hostile waters, whereas Northeast Atlantic is always safe waters.

InfamousKilla

@Watchkeeper - I like the attitude. Also, you CAN force deck battle on a pirate when they melee you. It happened to me early on in server, I got my ass kicked by a low level merchant while I was trying to plunder him! I'm too lazy to grind deck battle again (because it can't be used on white players) so now I'm more careful about aboarding people and mostly just shoot them down. I get no plunder this way, but I'm not out to steal personally. I just enjoy stopping people for a moment to show them my new cannnons. and say, "Hello."

HuseyinGazi

When I was new ( July 2014 till begin 2015), I used to be a scaredy cat whenever I enter in hostile/lawless waters alone and relied on my friend the first two month while carrying blue flag (used modded TLG and then Big Trading Clipper). Whenever I saw a pirate on search... either I sailed to the nearest port or took the longest detour by sailing far coast. It was very thrilling and fun when piracy was pretty active. ^^ 

After having large clipper, CeleHC and so on... I managed to find my own way to outrun pirates by being faster than them and counter their port camping, alt-spot and circle tactics. My heart would always beat fast whenever a pirate would be close to catch me, I truly miss that excitement. It took a while to study this out by myself and reading sources to interpret this. Being captured happens to me roughly once in two months and I am sure it wouldn't be like that when piracy becomes more active or whenever I am clumsy to hug coasts too much... This turned me from a scaredy cat into a carefree captain who doesn't pay attention anymore about the water states. :x

Therefore, this update wouldn't make much difference to me, however, I am not in a position to say this as not every player experience the same and in our time we had 24 hour protection. I am genuinely concerned that especially newer players will end up being victim by certain player pirates who will just flat ruin their fun by chasing them until their green flag wears off... Those new players won't have the patience to find out how to counter it and get discouraged to play the game further. I am convinced that this trial won't be a reality by seeing the negative feedback already and I don't want this being applied either as it damages the population even further. 

Furthermore, this change may not be need it at all since they add already a new feature called "pirate war" in the upcoming patch. There are actually alternatives in my eyes to encourage piracy without the cost of these nerfs, because right now being white or blue won't make any difference anymore plus as some players stated some pirates can exploit this farm method to turn waters lawless in a wimp. I wish this could been reconsidered... sorry for those that I couldn't cease it along with other CA's.. :/

Just note when you get sunken by a pirate that you get your minimum crew (used to be 1-5 crew just) back through rescue to sail at full performance which makes 10 minutes green flag often plenty to evade them unless the ship can't outrun them (pirate needs to have that much patience to and by that time their noto drops quite fast as well). Can give the following tips if you're in this position (or when you tribute):

- If your speed is roughly equal to the pirate; try to shake the pirate off by changing course in unpredictable manner until the player loses your sight and don't know where to look at. This works well especially when you enter into the next sea where no one knows which direction you sail afterwards. Just make sure you've your private status so they can't detect you on search radar.

- Try to lure them to aggressive npc fleets nearby while you've your green flag (not certain if it protects you from that), once the pirate gets attacked, it takes time for him/her to finish it and by that time you've escaped from their sight. 

- This sounds stupid, but if you got attacked at a crowded area, then use the time to port somewhere nearby where rarely someone comes. Pirates or Bounty hunters lacks of patience to wait long for just one person to leave in a quiet area (logout or go private full block).

- Have heavy bombing as original skill and get rapid fire or decent fast loading normal shot that slows the pirate down. They are unable to get you in melee at the ring as they are too slow then and you escape by that time. At some point that pirate gets tired and leaves you alone.

- If more bounty hunters are participating during the trail, ask help to one who is nearby by either fleeting you for a while or distract the pirate till you're gone from that area. :-)

Finally, for those who've issue with the idea of Papaya, I know how painful it is to most of you and that this may flat ruin your days. Although bear in mind it is temporary and with your feedback this trial may not apply at all and I personally don't see that happening easily. Complaining and using vulgarity won't bring us anywhere right now and at this point we players are responsible that makes other players (especially new ones) quit, therefore, have patience for now x_x 

I hope my feedback and tips will help those to survive this trial by that time :-)

Kind Regards,

a2b2c2

If you implement this rule, reds should only be able to enter a pirate port, or a port in a lawless area. Orange could also enter their own ports, or ports allied to their nation.

The BH in my former company quit in part because the pirates ran to port whenever a BH appeared.

Pirates can stroll into any city at any time and openly conduct business, or sit in a bazaar, or just feel safe. That's a total perversion of the idea of being a pirate. 

Unlimited attacks has already be tried, and it was removed for all the reasons above. The one-hour rule was a great compromise. 

There are lots of PvP games out there. UWO was unique in the balance between pirates, BH, adventurers and merchants. It has steadily become more unbalanced in favor of the fighters. I get that the PvP people pay the most right now, but the new features are almost exclusively for fighters. There is very little useful stuff for adventurers and merchants to buy except No-War and Nanban items. All the buffs help the fighters as much as everyone else.

CrzyPsycoChick

@HuseyinGazi

I know you tried to talk them out of it but when you have a guy like Naver spending his mortgage and kids college tuition on the game who do you think they going to listen to??? Definitely not you definitely not us traders 

That mf'er get away with anything! Publicly Curse out the GM, publicly told all the CAs they suck D*ck, publicly call for a boycott of the game ON THEIR OWN FORUM! He hasn't been permabanned yet?!? How? I've been muted banned permabanned for FARRRRRR LESS than that. Now I'm not saying he should be perma banned we need all players but I DO believe he gets away with MURDER way more than any of the rest of us just because he spends the most and that I DO BELIEVE and that's not fair.  Now we have to play the game according to Naver's vision because he's a whale? That's BS man.

I bet he just sitting there laughing at us because he has so much influence in the game I tell you what people are saying in game...they are saying it feels like he paid off people to get what he wants with his excessive papaya coin spending. Sorry, that's what they're saying...

Now I may be wrong he may well be right and this rejuvenates the game and we were all wrong in that scenario we'll have to eat our words and apologize to him BUT if he's wrong and the server collapses more... He WILL have to fall on his sword and take FULL RESPONSIBILITY for any further decline of the game because he was the main facilitator of this farming whites movement and he'll be the main one to blame.So he better be right about his "vision" that only farming can save this game that's all I'm saying. Any RE company members reading this be prepared for ANY fall out caused by his actions... 

InfamousKilla

     I grew up playing Uncharted Waters on SNES, and it was one of my favorite games. The only reason I ever found this game was because I tweeted this. https://twitter.com/TheRealKillaDub/status/306628556140716033 in February of 2013. 

While reminiscing about those good old days, I started to wonder what an online MMORPG of this series would be like. Then I checked to see if anyone else was thinking the same. It turns out the game was launched in October of 2010.

I was a couple years behind and didn't have the expendable income to, "Pay To Win." Suffice it to say that I sailed a barca and other crappy ships that took forever to get from point A to point B. 

When I first started, "Expedition Ship Boarding Tickets" were valued at 1m each and dungeons had not yet been nerfed. I went to the dungeon in Syracuse and would get one everytime I killed the boss. I did this 50 times and earned 50 ESBT.

Then used those 50 ESBT to buy the Tiger Helm that I had always wanted. I was trading spice without purchase orders and port-hopping from Calicut to Cochin when BroonX attacked me and plundered my new hat that it took me so long to obtain.

     This was my first emcounter with a pirate. He managed to kill me a couple more times before I escaped Indian Ocean. I was upset, but I didn't whine about it. I got smart, tried harder, and vowed to be the best pirate on the server.

Instead of letting people bully me, I decided to get stronger and faster so nobody could bully me. This was a long process, but I feel like I eventually got there, and it was worth all the effort.

Many things about this game are very realistic, and pirates in reality were a huge threat. Where balance comes in is with bounty hunters, these are usually the best maritimers on the server. 

They chase the pirates around and camp them until they give up, while merchants and adventurers can come and go at will. These do not exist without pirates, and pirates are not actively pirating because of the low population.

Most of us don't want to terrorize people and make plunder our main source of income, we just want to have fun. So if we are really irritating someone, they can call for help, If Bounty Hunters show up then PVP is reborn.

For example say there is 1 pirate outside Calicut terrorizing everyone he can, well the people he is bugging can ask their company members or others on world chat to come help chase the pirate away or subdue him in port.

evilmedieval

if you can handle being attacked  STAY OUT OF HOSTILE / LAWLESS waters .very simple ,if you cant handle the consequences of the risk you don't deserve the gain period ......

37danmark

i think it will be a misstake to do this i dont mind pirats it is a part off the game but many dont like to be hit all the time and will leave game and to many pirats just sit and camp (not a nice way to play) and it just make all trad/adv player hate even more we got room for all now so i dont get that we need to spend time to do new better to get more job that got row skill not just pirat job ty :)

kingblurple

im against this all the slower ships and lower lvl players are just gonna be farmed and killed and some may get though it but most would quit, other high lvl players will struggle but still better off then new players, id say 30-45 minutes to get away after attacked. or if pirates become notorious give an incentive for bounty hunters to chill and protect traders if we have pirates fine but make a real bounty hunter that gets rewarded for his work. thanks for keeping the game going.

Klandestine

All I think really needs to be done is give white name players a 30 minute green flag after being attacked, win lose or draw. Keep everything else the way it is.  From what I have heard in the chat over the last couple of days, the huge majority of players would find this acceptable.  Personally I would be fine with that.

BUT...

If PvP is what you really want to fix then the best long term solution would be a complete revamp of the PvP system that would make it more dependent upon a players ability rather than gear, skill ranks or levels.

Ship battle needs to be more player dependant.  Players should have to aim, lead the ship, time the roll, target the parts of the ship they want to hit etc...etc...etc...  Maneuvering and sail handling should be manual only, no point an click movement.  All ammo types should be available regardless of cannon type and make reloading with different ammo types a separate skill.

Melee...not really sure how to address that other than to take ranks out of it. Frankly I think it's the best part of the battle system.

Deck/Land battle and duels.  This is my least favorite part of the battle system and arguably the most important for a non-maritime focused character since  you have a chance to bypass cannon and melee battle and so give up fewer skill slots in order to compete in battle effectively.

To improve it you need to make it more active.  Increase the number of available actions beyond techs.  I would offer as a starting point: Hack, Slash, thrust, parry, riposte, kick, punch,  duck, dodge and jump.  I selected those because there are 10 spots on the npad you could use, but I'm pretty much open to anything at this point.

Anyway, these are just examples intended as a starting point for consideration.  I fully realize the difficulty if not outright impossibility of making this kind of a change but if you really want to attract PVP oriented player, that would, in my opinion at least, be the way to go.

I love  PvP games.  I just don't love UWO's version of it.  Take a look at some of the more popular PvP games and see why they are as popular as they are an although FTP, are making money thru their cash stores without being pay-to-win..

The lack of PvP in the current game is not because anyone has done anything to restrict it.  PvP is as available now as it has ever been since the game was launched.  That is not the issue.  If players wanted to pvp they would, pure and simple.  But that is not what they want.  What they want is to steamroll weaker players and take their stuff an that is not PvP, it is ganking  pure and simple, and that will hurt the game.

The changes being implemented may indeed result in a new "Golden Age of Piracy".  But it would be terribly sad if were also the final nail in the coffin of this wonderful game.

ragin1311

1 hour is bad enough but i can live with it.

if the no limit goes into effect i may quit.

i barely play as is so give me a reason to take the little money i spend with you else were.

ragin1311

1 hour is acceptable

ragin1311

1 hour is acceptable

ragin1311

1 hour is acceptable.

this may be what makes me quit.

good to see the little money i might have spent is unwanted.

ragin1311

1 hour is acceptable.

this may be what makes me quit.

good to see the little money i might have spent is unwanted.

ragin1311

1 hour is acceptable.

this may be what makes me quit.

good to see the little money i might have spent is unwanted.

Johan101073

LOL... 

You kids be smart, and don't even implement that three weeks' trial period...

First ones you're gonna scare away are the relatively new, 'weaker' players.

If this would become permanent, a lot of 'veterans' will follow.

Agreed that Pirates add some spice to the game, agreed that they could be rewarded more for their 'work', and absolutely no problem with it if that would be in lawless (lawless as in: as it is now...), or when they win battle against BH, ...

But trust us on this one: you really can't afford to make ludicrous blunders like this... :p

xujin1

thumbs up！

This is real UWO.

ragin1311

1 hour is acceptable.

this may be what makes me quit.

good to see the little money i might have spent is unwanted.