[PvP Trial Period] Unlimited Battles on Seas! (Closed)

pieratthe

ya'll? i had nothing to do with this.  I havn't played in forever cause of the p2w. This has nothing to do with me.  Also the low population has turned me away from the game.  Kinda hard to pirate and have fun with only 300 people per day on server.  Game is too big for such low population.  The few that play still, prolly perfer the single player aspect of it but i don't.  Also don't care if it dies or not.  I hope it succeds, but i doubt it.

CrzyPsycoChick

Whoa Whoa Whoa Whoa Whoa!  Hold up wait a minute let me get this straight… 

So Pirates SUPPORT the Naver piracy rules for farming but dont want to be associated with having anything to do with it in case it goes south to avoid the backlash?! 

Naw naw nawwwww it dont work that way.  You can't support farming the trader class but be TOO SCARED to accept the consequences of your decision to support him /desire for the GM to push his farming rules. 

You CANNOT straddle the fence on this one in case it goes bad and say oh well uhhh I supported it and things got worse but but dont blame me I didnt do nuffin? Nah ya need man up and stand or not stand with his policy and ANYTHING that comes with it be it negative or positive. 

So I will ask you simply..  

Are you with Naver and SUPPORT the push for The Naver Piracy Rules? 

Or

Are you NOT with Naver and DO NOT support  the push for The Naver Piracy Rules? 

Choose Wisely… 

pieratthe

You can't force me to support anything Naver does just cause i'm the PieRat.  I support whatever decision makes this game healthy with loads of players so i got plenty of people to plunder.  You know thats all i care about lol.   I did say the game was at it's best before the nerfs to piracy.  And that's a fact u can't argue.  Now, was it cause of the pirate rules i can't say either way.  Many many decisions i do not support.  I do however support this.  I hate being farmed but i still pirate so i don't cry about it too much.  But this isn't farming.  U have 10 minutes to get somewhere after u are defeated.   It takes most peeps 30ish minutes to get from EU to EA.  So in 10 minues u can easily get to a town.  Yes it does prevent you from non-stop sailing and only using 1 tribute per day per pirate.  But 5m/trib?????  or say you end up getting hit every nanban trip by the same pirate cause of new rules.  so what 300-500m/run.. and u cry about using 5m/trib each time. LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL.  Ok so u adventure, ur sailing into a port and u get hit right before u get there, u trib** 5m/  go inside the town/landing do whatever ur needing to do.  U goto leave, there's that pirate again.  5m/trib  keep going.  Ok so ur doing nanban all day or u wanna adventure for several hours.  U'll be in a place that's known for pirates for a lengthy period.  Either spend 5m/ trib  or support the game and get a blue flag.  wow.  Don't be so greedy as to cry because now it's going to cost u some money ingame to either makes LOTS of money (nanban) or to have fun and ejoy urself doing adventure u have to trib or flag.   OMG  do u not hear urselfs?   So yea if ur grinding maritime in like black sea, and every 10 minutes same pirate fleet comes along yea that'll suck a little, but what???????? keep some trib's on u.  black sea can't go lawless so no need to worry about that.  or.. FIGHT THE PIRATES.  omg yea dura repairment costs money.  but what doesn't??? can't believe u wanna play all day in game and hate having to spend a little ingame money to secure urself.   This is mosty the reason i don't play anymore cause it's 100% well maybe 98% carebear crybabies.... so enjoy.  

But don't include me in with Naver.

FleabagNO1

Windstalker here:

First
point: what had to be said about flags, been said, so I wont dwell on that

Second : I
sail this game for a few years again, mainly without flags. I do namban and I love
the excitement of pirates.

I have been
white, orange and red and I have faced being farmed massively by Blues who took
adventage when I was a beginner and NOT able to help myself.

If it wasn’t
for a long term game experience I might have quit, but I am stubborn and sworn
revenge.

Interesting experience : During all the time its been mainly the socalled goodies who caused unhappyness or their alts among players..less pirates or socalled baddies. 

This change
to a new maritime system will show a bunch of problems:

PP will
face a hell off loss of players for we have a playerbase of 80% trade/adv and
MAYBE 20% marit.

PP already
have made the mistake with the WIPE what led into a totally unbalanced system and
a lot of players stopped playing.

I have the
feeling PP doesn’t realizes what good playerbase they have. Within half a year
most cities , structures etc have been rebuilt!

THAT IS
playerwork and RLmoney! Playertime !

PP ! What
is a game without players? Never take loyality for granted…less even RL money support!

With this
change a lot of improvements like Astronomy become absurd.

Quote:
ccsray88

Thinking
about “Weather Phenomena”, those discoveries at sea that need time and
patience, how can adventurer stop their ship at the spot to wait for the
phenomena to appear when pirate is able to appear anytime and farm the waiting
adventurer. Using of large tribute will only buy a few minutes while phenomena
often take far more time than that to appear. Same problem will appear on
charting and pulling shipwrecks where player need to stay in the same water
doing it, a pirate which can continuously attack and farm which force the
player to abandon the effort.

Some doing just
NEED protection be it against NPC or players. Consider the short term of time u
plan for flags around suez ? You will constantly defend against npc to raise a
ship.

Have u ever
considered that?

You kill
fun and the possibilities of this game and even improvement to please a handful
of people.

We already
face that most NONE bottle equipment (extreme expensive) cant be used on sea
for the risk of being ambushed and plundered.

Not very fun
and now no more reason to purchase them from Alchemists!

It’s been
those changes what is killing Alchemy. Who needs items you are likely to lose!

Next to new
and beginner players..

I have
NEVER seen or experienced BIG Pirates to attack me while I was small. In
contrary they usually been helpful.. DO THEIR JOB …ambush.. but make sure I got
to next port.

It’s a
profession!

WHAT we can’t
support is FARMING!

Farming IS
HARRASSMENT and must be banned.

We play the
game, support it to have fun and relax!

NONE of us
is willing to pay for unhappiness or waste our time. Lots of nice new games
outside.. no need to be unhappy.

CPC already
pointed out the problem ..

OLD players
…routine players consider please:

Maritime is
a complex fight..

You guys suggest
grinding ..growing ..u guys have forgotten the time u been without skills

You forget
maritime is a fight where a new player has to coordinate shock , handling ,
strategy, keyboard and emotion parallel !

It takes
big time to get routine.

New players
sit at sea, worried, frustrated and often lost, close to frustration tears.

They NEED
time to recollect !

Its not
only grinding BR its fighting an enemy!

And farming
WILL take the fun out of game and leads to utter frustration.

Especially
as those who support it offend and destroy the will of playing this game.

Again !

I am not
against Pirates but won’t it be better to attract new or old players in a
different way?

Break up
the effects by massive blocking of whole continents mayors of one single person
or group?

Add an
anti-grief rule like on Asian servers and make sure economy can’t get out of
control.

Also give
players the time to grind produce search etc.

Right now
one event hunts the next..

Players
need time to PLAY

Maybe add
events like the twitter sceenshot event what allows playing .. or write tiny
stories ,poems , create new crests etc

When shall
the player live or play?

Farming won’t
lead to more players neither happiness…

All we NOW
GET is the players banned from other servers for harassing people there !

Quote
Roiber:

It takes
all of us - pvp, pve, traders, builders, etc - to move this game forward, so
get off your little perches and realize your alienating a good portion of the
financial support for this game.

FleabagNO1

First
point: what had to be said about flags, been said, so I wont dwell on that

 

Second : I
sail this game for a few years again, mainly without flags. I do namban and I love
the excitement of pirates.

 

I have been
white, orange and red and I have faced being farmed massively by Blues who took
adventage when I was a beginner and NOT able to help myself.

 

If it wasn’t
for a long term game experience I might have quit, but I am stubborn and sworn
revenge.

 

This change
to a new maritime system will show a bunch of problems:

 

PP will
face a hell off loss of players for we have a playerbase of 80% trade/adv and
MAYBE 20% marit.

 

PP already
have made the mistake with the WIPE what led into a totally unbalanced system and
a lot of players stopped playing.

 

I have the
feeling PP doesn’t realizes what good playerbase they have. Within half a year
most cities , structures etc have been rebuilt!

 

THAT IS
playerwork and RLmoney! Playertime !

 

PP ! What
is a game without players? Never take loyality for granted…less even RL money support!

 

With this
change a lot of improvements like Astronomy become absurd.

Quote:
ccsray88

Thinking
about “Weather Phenomena”, those discoveries at sea that need time and
patience, how can adventurer stop their ship at the spot to wait for the
phenomena to appear when pirate is able to appear anytime and farm the waiting
adventurer. Using of large tribute will only buy a few minutes while phenomena
often take far more time than that to appear. Same problem will appear on
charting and pulling shipwrecks where player need to stay in the same water
doing it, a pirate which can continuously attack and farm which force the
player to abandon the effort.

 

Some doing just
NEED protection be it against NPC or players. Consider the short term of time u
plan for flags around suez ? You will constantly defend against npc to raise a
ship.

Have u ever
considered that?

 

You kill
fun and the possibilities of this game and even improvement to please a handful
of people.

 

We already
face that most NONE bottle equipment (extreme expensive) cant be used on sea
for the risk of being ambushed and plundered.

Not very fun
and now no more reason to purchase them from Alchemists!

It’s been
those changes what is killing Alchemy. Who needs items you are likely to lose!

 

Next to new
and beginner players..

 

I have
NEVER seen or experienced BIG Pirates to attack me while I was small. In
contrary they usually been helpful.. DO THEIR JOB …ambush.. but make sure I got
to next port.

It’s a
profession!

 

WHAT we can’t
support is FARMING!

 

Farming IS
HARRASSMENT and must be banned.

 

We play the
game, support it to have fun and relax!

NONE of us
is willing to pay for unhappiness or waste our time. Lots of nice new games
outside.. no need to be unhappy.

 

CPC already
pointed out the problem ..

 

OLD players
…routine players consider please:

 

Maritime is
a complex fight..

 

You guys suggest
grinding ..growing etc

 

You forget
maritime is a fight where a new player has to coordinate shock , handling ,
strategy, keyboard and emotion parallel !

It takes
big time to get routine.

New players
sit at sea, worried, frustrated and often lost, close to frustration tears.

They NEED
time to recollect !

 

Its not
only grinding BR its fighting an enemy!

And farming
WILL take the fun out of game and leads to utter frustration.

Especially
as those who support it offend and destroy the will of playing this game.

 

Again !

I am not
against Pirates but won’t it be better to attract new or old players in a
different way?

Break up
the effects by massive blocking of whole continents mayors of one single person
or group?

Add an
anti-grief rule like on Asian servers and make sure economy can’t get out of
control.

 

Also give
players the time to grind produce search etc.

Right now
one event hunts the next..

 

Players
need time to PLAY

 

Maybe add
events like the twitter sceenshot event what allows playing .. or write tiny
stories ,poems , create new crests etc

 

When shall
the player live or play?

 

Farming won’t
lead to more players neither happiness…

 

All we NOW
GET is the players banned from other servers for harassing people there !

 

Quote
Roiber:

It takes
all of us - pvp, pve, traders, builders, etc - to move this game forward, so
get off your little perches and realize your alienating a good portion of the
financial support for this game.

FleabagNO1

ok forgive the stupid structure of post ..had to write in word copy paste ..blush .. ouch

purplepirate

Pie, although i know you didn't expect things to go this far you DID sign Naver's petition on RE website to remove the 24h piracy rule. As did CPC, although in her case, she at least gave a condition to her agreement that if it were to happen then there had to be some balancing factor to protect against farming whites. I did agree that the rule needed to be changed but i didn't sign his petition because i didn't agree with the format that he presented it in nor could he prove that his claims would happen. What i did do though was come up with a counter proposal that addressed various problems with the current system and found a balance to make things fair for everyone if that rule was going to be removed, mainly by fixing the BH profession and limiting how people can be farmed.

http://forum.papayaplay.com/index.php?p=/discussion/364061/proposal-for-a-balanced-game-system#latest

chronofox

O cpc once again u are pushing some kind of drama nothing new .So now itsu or against or side with naver lol trying to  push it to a 2 sided thing lol .


And how did the rules/guidelines that where there from the start of the game become naver pirate rules lol


people are making a huge deal out of this for nothign any one that played back in the day should know this we did just fine back thin .


people use to lol at pirates even back in the day because they had the skills to keep there self safe like high storage  and the ship skill that make plunder next to use less.

U people are tring to turn pirates in to some huge monster that u think every one should fear there not.
 The real prob is people have alts now that they sail with thats the only diff from now and back thin.And they dont want to buy 3 blue flags.

Also cpc didnt u also make a  topic not long ago about how u think the co killed crafting i for one would think u would be all for pirates being able to plunder better and more agin from a crafters stand point.

More  pirates = more bhs=more cannons and gear that can be made and sold

Also id be fine if the limit was 10 -20mins max that morethin enouth time to get out of x sea allmost no matter where u are .

And yes there are going to be a few
pirates that take farming to the extreme so what should all pirates be held back because of a few.

IF u dont like it hire bodyguards like people use  to back in the spice run days before nanban
TO low lv and not the $$ join a guild and get help

Maybe with this the concept of working togeather will come back to the game some and not be such a all for one with alts kind of deal.
  

 

viennas

 @pieratthe

 ''It will just rid the game of all the cry babies.  Those that are scared of a little pvp. ''

....

I think this sentence point out the manipulations and spinns very well. To call a pvp a clipper vs. few billion battle ship is absurd in the first place. We can apply this same logic and reason back and ask, why don't you sail red in a clipper? Are you afraid of pvp? Cry baby. It's a method which some people use to fill their egos and self worth, a method where is 100% win guarantee. Not much smarter is Papaya either, they also seems to consider a clipper vs. a battle ship PVP. This game has nothing to do with reality, where armed merchant ship could easy sink any pirates. But under such terms, people like Nellemus,.. would hardly exist in this game, since people would often sink them, if they could fight back. In UWO they can't, and that's they key point what keeps pirates in this game so much, they love to exploit the unfair system, to get their ''wins'',..and after it even blame the victims,...

purplepirate

@viennas good lord, i'll be so glad when you are gone from this patch TROLL...

CapitaineLapin

After the
release of the details concerning the removal of any restriction concerning the
amount of times a white-named player can be attacked/farmed/plundered within a
certain amount of time, the community has reacted heavily to this situation
with good reasons.

 I do agree
nanbanners have had it pretty easy for the past years without having much to
worry about pirates since there is almost none and that after they get attacked
by that pirate, they basically can keep playing in peace for the next hours
since they either will meet the same pirate that attacked them earlier, or will
just not meet any pirates at all.

 I decided
to propose my own ideas to maybe change a bit the way the thing were supposed
to go toward. Although, it will be necessary to fix a bug (if it is a bug) wich
makes that when a white-named player gets engaged by a pirate and that this
white-named player manages to kill the pirate, he becomes a blue-named player
(Bounty Hunters/BH). In my opinion you should only be able to become a BH
through attacking a pirate.

 

1.        1.Keeping the limit a white-named
player can be attacked every 1 hour by the same pirate or reducing it by 30
minutes. Completely removing might make some pirates start disrupting the
gameplay of other players even if they did or did not look for the farming
result.

2.        2.Make blue-named players/BH an actual
thing. Pirates and Bounty hunters are players that should always be ready for a
fight. I recommend that Bounty hunters can be engaged in any sea at any time,
even in safe waters pirates should be able to engage bounty hunters thus
creating a sort of rivalty between blue-named and red/orange-named players.

3.        3.This one is a little bit trickier
since I do not really know the answer to it. I’d say increase the rewards
coming from pirating and Bounty Hunting to motivate player to do so. Maybe something
with the scoreboard with a weekly/monthly reset with rewards for best players
giving away exclusive rewards that can be useful to any classes. This one
needed a bit more thought about it but I’ll let the others propose what they
have in mind.

 

I personally
believe that letting the pirates farm traders again will just disrupt the
players that just wants to play the game. 
I have been playing this game for a long time and I know what it feels
like to be farmed by a pirate and it is not a good feeling at all. I haven’t
check if these have already been proposed. I am pretty sure it’s flawed a bit
but with everyone’s help we can maybe get to a possible answer. My English isn’t
the best so please be forgiving about that x.x Feel free to bring up more ideas
to these proposition. I just believe the best way to bring back piracy is to bring
a rivalty and encourage the PvP between 2 teams of players with of course some
loot. J

 

Legacy / Asura / Lapin 

Knoert56

I wonder, how is giving up the 1 hour rule making the game more exciting for pirates?

What's the fun attacking someone who is already down?

I think , that if you are not a coward, it would be much more exciting when the game would be more dangerous to pirates. I real life pirates were hanged. The least the game could do is to chase them with powerful npc fleets through european waters and with cityguards through the cities. And if they got caught to put them behind bars. That would be proper excitement. There should be big money in the bountyhunting business and the possibility to hire an escort at the port official, to be paid per (game) day and per ship in fleet. And escorts should be able to collect their wages at the port official.

Just some suggestions to try something new

CrazeeOrange

 I do think that a total removal of time duration restrictions on pirates is a really bad idea and PPP should not even consider a trial period.
In Gama, pirates were able to attack white names repeatedly. We already have experienced it before. And we do know how bad it can get.  I am one of the players who have been around since India patch and have witnessed how players quit due to this in the past and have never returned. Even if they do return, they only do so after a few years, not months. Therefore, a trial period is a terrible idea.
1)    This piracy change affects players who do not have ships ducats and other resources more than rich players with fast ships. Even f you do have a fast ship like SHC, SLS and so on, when you carry any goods, you face a sail penalty even if you have a ship with 100 wave resistance. You will always be slower than a ship without cargo in the same setup
2)    Tributes will not work as a countermeasure for many players. Pirates will just follow your ship since they are in a speed setup and you will run out of tributes at some point. Once again, spare a thought for players without resources.

3)    Right now, PPP has not done anything to farming of alt accounts, use of alt accounts to force neutral players blue. How is this relevant to this change? Pirates can farm alts right on day 1 o force seas to be lawless if desired. This has already occurred before in GAMA. Some players have admitted in MARIS too that they have done it. They can hide in a corner of that ocean tile to do this  I have sent in screenshots to you, PPP by the way of people getting around the .1 hr restriction ( yes its possible) and you have not addressed it properly til now.

4)    Bounty hunter titles require 3X the honor as pirate titles. PPP, if you are saying that this is the way it is set up, please apply the same reasoning to wuxu east asia goods price discrepancy and compare prices to Japanese server. We know that you are using that reason only when you like it. The costs of active bounty hunt (pure blue name) is considerably high as compared to occasional bounty hunt especially for organized teams. The cost is also higher than piracy. We would appreciate the honor requirement for bounty hunter titles adjusted to be the same as pirate titles at least. What you are doing, PPP is to force blue names to farm alts for titles too.

5)    It is incorrect to say that if there are more pirates there will be more bounty hunters.
Correlation does not mean causation. It wil be more accurate to say that if there are more pirates, t will be more probable that more bounty hunters will appear.  Right now. You only receive a bounty if you sink pirates via canons. Item plunder occurs via melee only. Does PPP want all mariitimers to do only melee combat in 10V10? That’s so boring. Will PPP consider allowing blue names to get tem plunder at a reduced probability using canons vs orange and reds?
6)    Right now, trade 11 accounts can enter seas outside Europe. Pirates can use these to log in as spotter acounts and refuse to log in their prate accounts.  When pure blue names (bounty hunters) arrive, they can only stare at that spotter account. Why are trade 11 accounts even allowed in east asia waters for instance. Prates can pass items and ducats to storage accounts. PPP, can we at least try to discourage players from doing this by setting a minimum 10K fame requirement to enter some seas, for example east asia? IF you are not ready to fix the loopholes don’t launch changes unprepared.
7)    Piracy is not ALL of maritime. PPP. Be very clear on this. There are a number of players who take art in battel campaign, ESF, mocks. PPP, you may check on who came up with the suggestion to remove durability loss in battle campaign, if you want to. Did it come from a pirate?
8)     In Gama, there are a number of players who behaved badly after pirating on players. Name calling, Player lynching, you name it you have it. Echoesoftimezero and gacaptmorgan were spreading anti-Asian campaigns on forums and ingame. My adventurer friend who brought 4 other friends for a long adventure quest chain was accused of multi 5. Can we leave the policing of mult-5 to pirates? Based on what happened in gama, the answer is no. For this case, PPP, you need to improve your IT system to auto detect players using more than 3 accounts at the same time.  The responsibility to police this lies mainly with you here. In fact, I was sent threats via PM  back then for standing up for some players.

These are some of the thoughts I have for this matter.  I only came in to post on forums after being requested by some CAs. I am busy with writing proposals for players in internal channels right now,  I have already sent in tickets to PPP for a number of issues, which is not resolved til this day. To be honest, at this point, most players have run out of patience with PPP.

Thank you for reading.
Buffet

CapitaineLapin

After the
release of the details concerning the removal of any restriction concerning the
amount of times a white-named player can be attacked/farmed/plundered within a
certain amount of time, the community has reacted heavily to this situation
with good reasons.

 

I do agree
nanbanners have had it pretty easy for the past years without having much to
worry about pirates since there is almost none and that after they get attacked
by that pirate, they basically can keep playing in peace for the next hours since
they either will meet the same pirate that attacked them earlier, or will just
not meet any pirates at all.

 

I decided
to propose my own ideas to maybe change a bit the way the thing were supposed
to go toward. Although, it will be necessary to fix a bug (if it is a bug) wich
makes that when a white-named player gets engaged by a pirate and that this
white-named player manages to kill the pirate, he becomes a blue-named player
(Bounty Hunters/BH). In my opinion you should only be able to become a BH through
attacking a pirate.

 

1.       Keeping the limit a white-named
player can be attacked every 1 hour by the same pirate or reducing it by 30
minutes. Completely removing might make some pirates start disrupting the
gameplay of other players even if they did or did not look for the farming
result.

2.       Make blue-named players/BH an actual
thing. Pirates and Bounty hunters are players that should always be ready for a
fight. I recommend that Bounty hunters can be engaged in any sea at any time,
even in safe waters pirates should be able to engage bounty hunters thus
creating a sort of rivalty between blue-named and red/orange-named players.

3.       This one is a little bit trickier
since I do not really know the answer to it. I’d say increase the rewards
coming from pirating and Bounty Hunting to motivate player to do so. Maybe
something with the scoreboard with a weekly/monthly reset with rewards for best
players giving away exclusive rewards that can be useful to any classes. This
one needed a bit more thought about it but I’ll let the others propose what
they have in mind.

 

I
personally believe that letting the pirates farm traders again will just
disrupt the players that just wants to play the game.  I have been playing this game for a long time
and I know what it feels like to be farmed by a pirate and it is not a good
feeling at all. I haven’t check if these have already been proposed. I am
pretty sure it’s flawed a bit but with everyone’s help we can maybe get to a
possible answer. My English isn’t the best so please be forgiving about that
x.x Feel free to bring up more ideas to these proposition. I just believe the
best way to bring back piracy is to bring a rivalty and encourage the PvP
between 2 teams of players with of course some loot. J

 

Legacy /
Asura / Lapin

WildDiscovery

@ Miyamoto:
Problem is, doing adventuring quests in asian servers requires knowing a lot of Japanese/Chinese/Korean, for Maris UWO is the only English-language server left that I know of, and Im only fluent in English.

lowbridge

If I were a pirate under the current bounty rules, I would keep the absolute minimum of cash both on me and in the bank; storing my main stash on an alt. As such, if the pirate is unable to pay the bounty (to include from what is in the bank), does the bounty hunter only get what the pirate has? If that is true, wouldn't this essentially negate the main incentive to hunt bounties?

carssman

Biggest group of whiners I ever seen!!


If you can’t handle the pressure, play something else!

I think I’m going red now just flush out some of whiners from this server

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

This game needs new players, lots of them, and it needs to keep from losing players.

For a newbie the game has too much grinding, and even if someone invests the time to up their levels, fame and bank account, they will leave if they get plundered too easily.

Especially if they get cleaned out because they didn't understand how to protect themselves, or couldn't protect themselves because they didn't have a good enough ship.

My suggestion is that the new piracy rules being considered shouldn't apply to anyone with levels less than min 30/30/30. or maybe even 40/40/40.  If the very skilled players want this new rule to keep them challenged then that's fine, but please lets not lose another newbie to disenchantment with the game.

If lawless waters are going to be even considered, then there ought to be ways to overcome those threats, like escort vessels that can be hired for protection, or special vessel cloaks that can be applied to make the vessel invisible to attack.

Rather than make the game less interesting to new players, lets find ways to make it more interesting and more likely to keep players playing. 

For example, just like we see on land battles, how about if a player can switch to a "fight" view in a melee battle, so they can see what's happening.  How about making dungeons less dark, so your eyes don't go blind after looking into the dark for so long.  Maybe add in a little romance, like quests for a prince or princess's reward, or quests to rescue a prince or princess.  Even better, give everyone that wants a helping hand,  a way, or some way to get instant help in the game.

In summary, lets get new players to continue, and be excited to keep playing,  and not discourage regulars by causing them to lose hard earned goods, ships, or money to mean, greedy player/pirates.

Seems like Papaya needs to refocus on making the game more interesting, especially for newbies.

Spookles

Look at all these people panic :)

Solutions to your problems:

I will get farmed D:

- No you wont, use tributes or buy a blue flag. (Or make use of the MMO aspect of this game and ask friends???????)

The seas will turn forever red because of alt farming Dx

- No it won't, BHs are a thing. Check the logs and hunt that dude down.

Can confirm this works, I have bullied alt spotting pirates out of EA this way.

Furthermore you can just deny this guy entrance to your company, you can deny trading with him. Don't talk to him, ignore him. Hunt. Him. Down.

Or y'know, use that company of yours for good use and ask a maritimer in your comp to help you get out of a pirate camp 

LyonesseJoseph

1. I agree about 30 mins or 1 hour green flag since it means to be prevent players to farm others over and over again. Also, it will give players time to get away after they're being defeated.

2. CPC's suggestion of 5 minutes to attack players after they're logging on that I'd agree because it prevents players to use alt spotters ie Exilio then log on pirates to attack players after they leave port or LP.

3. As for bounty hunter, players need to earn that blue name by attacking pirate/privateer but not be hunted by them.

4. difference levels between players need to be enforced because OGP did terrible job that's reason why they ruined UWO.

5. Eliminating draining noto while sailing since it's probably reasons why many pirates don't go out sailing because of that. Not to mention green flag that they'd have to look for new victims to catch. If they want to get rid of red or orange, they can use discharge, pardon or recon (aide skill). Come to think later update will add rescue missions that will improve relations with Nations.

That's all I can think of for now.

adasek

very good idea more adventure and trade people will leave this game

CrzyPsycoChick

I think we can conclude this is a bad idea because even the people co-signing farming in this forum DO NOT want to put there name on this. When I asked if this doesn't work will they be willing to take responsibility/blame for this everyone is ducking and dodging saying yes because they're scared like chronofox and others. You see whenever I ask the question its a simple YES or NO they always add an essay answer about just use trib or buy flag or pirates are part of the game blah blah blah. 

Listen nobody cares about your essays for an argument nobody is making.  What we DO care about is this...If you're so sure this is good for the population of uwo then PUT YOUR A** ON THE LINE and stand by your beliefs and take responsibility if this fails and causes more harm than good...  If you support it but you're TOO AFRAID to willing to take the heat for it then you KNOW its a bad idea.</b>

To any supporter of this policy in all these threads unless you are willing to take the blame if it fails just proves you don't genuinely agree with your own points.Just put your name on it...declare you'll take responsibility THEN we'll all see who REALLY agrees with this or if they just want more targets. Go on I dare you to put your name on it any supporter ANY of you .. 

Will any you take responsibility for supporting it if it fails no essays no deflecting no more BS YES OR NO?</b>

Radekp

I am against it completely too. All is only geared to get even more money from people. Buy Blue flags, buy tickets to get the best ships and NC parts to resist pirates at seas. and you can listen only buy buy buy. This is a shame. This game should be about discoveries of uncharted waters as name announces but it is becoming more and more only about spending money. Old game was much better. 

adasek

Pirates are allowed to non stop hitting any players on sea  very good idea ......more adv and trade players will leave game 

SailorPapaya

I login only to check on the announcement from Papaya. Okay, this is how I feel.

I can see some sincerity from Papaya. If they are talking about "Trial", honestly speaking I won't even give a cent for it, because I know that is just a lie. 

But they are not. They gave a Trial with Period, mentioning EXACTLY it is from 1st of Aug to 22th. Okay, precise, formal, and crystal clear enough. That makes me earn a bit confidence back from them.

And secondly, I NEVER, EVER, EXPECT, Papaya will ask a feedback from the players. I was wrong about it. Because I am very sure that's the thing Papaya will never do even until the end of the world. But they prove me wrong today.

And I am glad I am wrong.

So let us proceed to the next point.

Based on what factors, measurements, judgement, your trial will result to?

We have to know that very clear. If you are judging from the players login count, then to disagree on this change, sorry I have to say, whoever do not agree with this and want to tell Papaya the answer, we should not login between 1st Aug to 22th Aug. 

I am not trying to make a problem here. Because if they are judging through the player counts, then the best way is not to login isn't it? Make the server as empty as possible. To tell them that we do not support it.

So if you are going to judge it by the profit? Then those who disagree, should not buy any uwc from 1st to 22th.

So I have no idea, based on what factors they are judging? Because I don't want to give them a wrong idea. If they judge by the player counts, then I will not login. If they judge by the profit, I will not spend. Else how are the majority is going to reflect that answer to them?

SailorPapaya

Okay below is the opinions and feedback.

Safe Waters, Hostile and Lawless in Sea Region... There is really not necessary to post that. Most of the old players know only within EU that it is a safe zone.

2nd, I found this factor really quite disturbing and seems a little bit misleading.

"When defeated, cannot initiate PvP for 10 minutes. 30 minutes if unable to pay Bounty."

Guys... when defeated, you are ending up with ONE SAILOR. How fast can a ship sail with 1 sailor? When we talk about dealing with pirates, we talk about avoiding melee contact at all cost. Fine tributes it is. Because once you are defeated, with one sailor, depend on your ship, how far are you from the sea, sometimes you can't even reach the nearest port in ONE HOUR.

Therefore when traders are melee and sunk by a pirate on sea, with 1 sailor in its crew, we usually ask for the mercy of pirates to take us to port. 

If that doesn't happen, we ask our guild mates to help.

If that is unavailable, we ask in Merchant Chat request for help.

Usually, I mean usually, no one in his right mind will try to sail back to a port from far sea to  the nearest city. They know that is absolutely stupid. They asked for help.

That only possible in 1hour or 24h restriction. Because the pirate can't attack you anyway, some good ones is willing to help.

So defeated and 10 mins, 30 mins, is a sentence of meaningless.

3rdly, if you are to sail into a lawless water, where fine tributes doesn't work, and you have no blue flags. Hit by a pirate, and your toon is wasted.

You might take weeks to grind your aide, these weeks are going to be wasted, in ONE pirate caught on you, to watch him from 100 loyalty to 0.

You might take months to obtain several items in your inventory, these months are going to be wasted, in ONE pirate caught on you, to watch all been plundered to a total emptiness.

For others, I think you would know how to disconnect when that happens. And don't dc in proper way, it is Ctrl-Alt-Esc, bring up the menu and end the program by force.

The next few hours, don't bother to login uwo. At all.

The thing is Papaya... we... do not make a game that its amount to lose : amount to obtain,  in such immense unbelievably risk.

Let me give an example.

Evony, is a web browser of city building and conquering game. 

This game officially graphic is good, game design and game play is not bad, from the level of a web browser. The only thing that is bad in it = 

Wake up in the morning and found the cities you built in months, weeks, gone in ashes. 

A player attacked you when you are sleep, you don't have the chance to defend it. (So what are the players suppose to do? Don't sleep?)

Do you get the meaning?

Players grind --> A lot of time --> Lost 70% --> in less than a few seconds

That is a fail game, in my opinion.

So what do you see in modern city building and conquering games? Clash of Titans? (Well I didn't play Clash of Titan actually, but I assume the design should be alike with the "modern trend")

Clash of Titans. A player attacked your city while you sleep. Your city is destroyed, but you lost something else, maybe your honor point, don't know. After that your city is rebuilt automatically. You do not lose your city entirely because of that attack.

I don't really mind if Papaya want to bias on pirates. But don't do it in a "direction" that totally destroy the balance of the game play.

Whatever buff they want to give to pirates, are fine, as long as they can get the maths right.

Whatever pirates can get ---> traders won't suffer the kind of losses that exceed the illogical amount.

That is why I am very against about the non stop farming. What non stop means? UNLIMITED LOSSES.

There are totally nothing to protect the traders from the pirates once they are caught once and get sunk. 

Except for them to logoff. In order to survive.

When you made a changes that actually force the traders into this kind of harsh and unreasonable circumstances, you are forcing the trader players to quit. 

So your game is not a might be, maybe, or perhaps. It is a will be. Your game will fail.

The losses someone suffered in game, must always be measured and calculated, that it will not exceed a certain limit.

Maybe a trader will lose 3 days time of worth to obtain one item and lost them in a pirate's plunder, that's fine.

If you are talking about a week?

Several weeks?

Months?

Don't do that.

Like I had mentioned. The green flag has no effect when it is as little as 5 minutes. 5 minutes are barely for a FULL-MODDED RLS, with FULL CARGO, with 50% SPEED, to run away from a FULL-MODDED pirate ship.

RLS is one of the fastest ship in the game. If RLS can barely do that, it just mean one thing to me. 99% of the ships in the server, can't

So the 5 minutes green flag is meaningless. It is completely useless.

As my experience of a trader for several years, an average  trader needs at least 20 minutes to run away from a pirate. 

If you are less than that amount of time, it is pointless.

CrzyPsycoChick

Good point you made...what is the metric for determining if this is a "success" or not? Money, buzz/ interest, login count, forum feedback.

What capacity will this feature be in if its deemed a success...will it be server wide permanent? only in lawless? Bi-weekly? 

Or maybe this is a test to see how this can be implemented to work out the kinks for a future compromise...testing is good. Are you trying to make the game more exciting before putting on steam or something?

Some more info of the goal or aim is needed...

Also I think in a previous patch they added if you're sunk you get your minimum crew back so that's good at least but still 5 min flag after trib is pointless like you said, it would tolerable if that same pirate can't attack that player for like 20 minutes. Also fine trib drop in Boston box so merchants don't craft them anymore...sad

Bottom line is you want players PLAYING not sitting in a port endlessly or logging out because pirates are camping. BH would help but if there's none around or if you're not in a maritime guild or you don't have the cash to pay a BH you're pretty much stuck there if there's no liner.. Trib can't be 5 mins...

SailorPapaya

Well, to clarify, I have no ideas some texts above are going into a rather big bold size. That looks kind of rude, but the system just gave me that. It is not my intention to format it that way.

Non stop farming, makes a pirate able to turn any sea regions into lawless easily.

That is something we do not want to see.

With very little amount of alts, the sea can be turn into lawless if they misuse the game play. 

24h protection which earlier made, is not totally into protection the trader players. Because we all know 24h is a ridiculous amount of time.

Who doesn't know 24h is ridiculous? If you do not know, ask yourselves one question.

Can you play 24h a day? If you cannot play 24h a day, why do you need 24h protection?

The 24h protection, is the same as giving the traders and adventurers the protection, as well as prevent pirates from abusing it.

They do not put on the 24h just to protect traders. No they didn't. This is what everyone knows. Because 24h is ridiculous.

So what I assume is, the pirates abuse and misuse the design of the game play too much, until the authority decide to give it a heavy nerf till 24h. They must be very mad about it. What happen, I have no idea. But I assume they must be very mad at that time.

I have this idea a while ago. I keep forgetting to post them as sometimes I have too many ideas coming in, some can work some can't work, so in the end I forgot a lot.

So my idea is this.

The more reasonable way to put this, is, IF, (a big IF), IF Koei can modify the game, and assign the interval of time can be attacked by pirates again, based on the activity in that sea region itself, will bring more balance to the game.

Let's say, a minimum time is decided. Let's make it 10 minutes. 

When there is one ship been attacked in sea region A, the time interval will increase to 15 minutes. Another ship, increase to 20 minutes, another ship, increase to 25 minutes.

So let's set the maximum time to 30 minutes.

So the more activity of pirates in the same sea region, the longer the time interval would be. The time will decrease slowly when there are no ships attacked in a period.

This way may not be perfect, but it does give more balance to the game play. We don't want pirate to camp around in the same area all the time.

And of course, when we talk about misuse and abuse, we know that traders may use the way for their alts to do that. That is why the suggestion is to set a minimum, and a maximum.

Another idea will looks better.

In my opinion, I sincerely, honestly, frankly, thoroughly, completely, totally, absolutely, without a doubt, think that a game design could allow all pirates camp outside a port --> just to attack any players sail out of the port.

= Stupidity.

So this is a question I always bring up. 

Many traders are zero-melee or zero-cannon skills. They have no cannons. They do not bring ammo in their cargo. 

Their trader ship is completely zero-defend against the pirates.

So the question here is simple.

Many pirates spent thousands to own a wonderful pirate ship. These pirate ships, are so strong, that it could sink other battle ships instead of trader ships.

So here comes the part I do not understand --> For what you try to kill a chicken with a nuclear bomb?

That is completely not necessary at all.

To camp outside the port, just to sink any traders ship that sail out of the port, I could just buy myself an "in-game" battle ship, modded it, and grind a few of my melee skills.

I could sink a lot of trader using one of the lousiest ship in the game. I don't even need a uwc ship.

But these pirates are actually having fun. They keep nuking chickens with nuclear bomb, which is totally overkill, and it is fun. 

They camp the whole day outside the port. And it is fun.

What kind of fun is that, I do not know. But I know they could feel the fun.

So the first point of mine is:

Having the best ship in the server, but only to camp outside a port, not moving everywhere, in order to get a prey, is stupid.

I do not mean the pirate players is stupid. I am pointing against the design.

Game structures. Their logic. Their design. Their fundamentals. This is what I am focused at.

In a sword fight mmorpg, when I get the best gear in the server, what I want to do, is I can own anyone, anywhere, any moment. Right?

So uwo should be doing the same thing.

The pirates who spent thousands of dollar in the game, should not just limit themselves into port camping. You can't blame them either.

How are they supposed to find a target in the far blind ocean?

In my opinion, pirates, should be able to get an item like the reward poster for BH hunting, works like a shipwreck, that they can detect the location of any ships in that sea region, with an X in a map. However, that should be immune to BH.

That would not be difficult. The fundamental is already there. You just need to modify a bit from shipwreck hunting to pirates hunting.

The "port-camping cultural" must be ceased. The pirates must be able to hunt on the big ocean. 

Chasing a prey is very intense and satisfied. We want to give the hunter, this kind of feeling in game, when they play.

Not feeding them in a corner with port camping isn't it?

Anyone of you play mmorpg together with your guild members, that activities are organised so we ambushed, chased and hunt other hostile guild members on the map?

Jesus, I can still remember that kind of scene, that kind of picture, that kind of moment, the feel of it, even it is years away. (But I just can't remember what the game is called lol)

So this is called fun.

When players play games, they want to win, yes, but in the same time, they want it to be fun.

So the success of the game, depends on how much fun you can offer to your players, in the way how you design the game, your structure and your logic. All of that is very important.

It is not something a publisher can do. It is from the developer.

But... it is what a publisher can choose.

carssman

Waaa!

More tears and more whining.

SailorPapaya

In the most intense mmorpg I played, which the wars and battles are so immense, we get nothing from our opponent when we beat them to the ground.

The person who is dead, has options to revived in several location. Based on that location, they can make a come back when the tactic is used right.

So can you see how immense the battles are?

The group of persons you just killed, sometime they can form a strategy, and defeat you back. It doesn't mean when you had killed them, you won. The battle is still to long for you to claim victory.

The rewards are on the maps. Whether it is a mobs-drop, random appear chest, or a timely appeared npc. I forgot what it is. It is some sort that looks like that.

So, the person I killed, I do not get anything from him. Yes, he may lose experience but he will not drop any gears.

Without that kind of fear, that's is why everyone keep rushing and reviving non stop. 

That is why the battles are so immense.

So fun.

So unforgettable.

So from a far long time ago, I already realize this. 

So, let's reverse the circumstances.

Now, everyone you defeat, you will lose something. You will drop your gear. You will drop even your skills.

Now, there is fear. Why there is fear? 

Would you see them keep dying and keep reviving and keep dropping gears? 

Go out from full gears at the start of the battle and end up an empty body at the end of the battle?

People will be very careful. Hesitate to go out. Stay in safe zone.

This is what I assume okay. Because I am reversing from a circumstance. But with the fear of losing something, more people will tend to play in the safe zone.

This logic should be correct. It must be correct.

So what drive someone rush to the front bravely, is the rewards.

What prevent someone from going to the battle field, is the losses.

What drives the battle mad, is the targets available in the battle field.

So when you put the rewards, in another fundamental, people will rush for it.

When you put the rewards, in a someone-gain someone-lost logic, people will be hesitate to join a fight.

So when you want to drive people to rush forward <--------> And then you discourage people to go out to fight

These are the two fundamentals, that counters each others.

So this is the example of what papaya is doing in uwo now.

They want more pirates, and yet they reduce the traders.

They want more traders, and then they will reduce the pirates.

This is a pain in the ass. I understand the situation. But this is not the right way to do it.

So for a very very long time, I keep telling papaya ---> go for the balance. Make it a win-win situation. Don't bias on something too much. It will not solve the problem.

Then I kind of feel that, they don't seems to get what balance is. It is not something that stand in the middle of something. 

Such as, 24h protection changed into 12h. Oh it is balance, and balance achieved. The game will finally success.

No. It is not. This is not the kind of "balance" I mean.

To understand, to feel what it is, first, you must seek for something lies in your heart.

FUN. JOY.

EXCITEMENT. TENSE.

ADDICTIVE. MIND OCCUPIED.

These are all the fundamentals that are needed to be understood, before what modifications and changes are needed for the players in your game.

The meaning of FUN, comes from the first impression of your game look. 
The JOY, is what happens when they actually involve themselves, and play it.

So, can you understand when it means.

When a game looks fun, but there is no joy when you play it?

Fun and Joy linked together, because it is related to the structures and the logic how you built it.

Let's take an example.

A game has these features. It has the most updated guns, rifles and other fire weapons that is used in a battle. Players can choose which gun to play it. The clips. The modifications. 

Wow, guns based on real life simulation. FUN ISN'T IT?

Then when you actually play into the game. 

Holy sh1t, you are using the guns to shoot flyaway dishes that are thrown to the sky.

Or. The damage of each gun looks the same, only the picture is different.

Or. The simulation of the guns looks perfect and realistic from each aspects. But you are having a fail AI as its targets.

When gamer see fun in a game features, they are attracted.

When they could not find joy into the game when they play, they quit.

It is just that simple.

So when you can make sure you can link Fun - Joy together, you succeed the first part.

Excitements. Tense.

These 2 fundamentals, are adrenalin driven. Not every game needs it, but among addictive,mind occupied and excitement, tense, either one, or both of them.

Excitements usually comes from battles. Not necessary battles, it could be just speed and racing without an opponent.

Every battle designed, can be excited. There is no real rules about it. But there is only something that can fail it.

The logic behind excitement, is control.

Tell me how can you fight a battle, that makes you excited, if you can't control nothing.

The control designed for every movements, placement, shortcuts, shortkeys, autokeys, flexibility.

When a battle can get a player hard to get excited, majorly because it is the bad design of the controls that is very un-user friendly to the players. 

The placement is illogical. The shortkeys are unavailable. Flexibility is an added great advantage though not every games have that. 

When someone can control something, and fight a battle. They get easily excited.

So what is tense?

Tense, is balance.

Tense are created, when you can kill as easy as you can get killed.

Let's take an example.

Serious Sam and Counter Strike.

The first one is excitement. The second one is excitement and tense.

Serious Sam are more like a cool and for fun shooting game, which you get big guns and slaughter anything around you like a rambo. Except when you meet the big boss, of course.

Counter Strike is different.

You could get an MP3 light weight gun or a AK47, you could die in a head shot just like that.

One sniper shot. Died as well.
But when you are close to the sniper. The sniper dies as well.

You can kill easy. And you can be killed easy.

So the battles in CS is exciting and tense. Your adrenalin are maxed out all the time. And you don't even want to feel you want to play it after a few hours of "torturing".

And finally. What is addictive and mind occupied?

Addictive, in games, not drugs, comes from the feeling that "I will just play it a little bit longer, for one last time."

But there is never a last time.

That is called additive.

So what makes a person addictive to game? Additive games has no fix modal or fix rule.

It depends individually, and personalities.

Let's take an example.

Farm villa, is actually a very addictive game.

Sim City.

Heroes of Might and Magic.

Xcom.

Even fighting games like Street Fighters. SF is too old. Lets just say Mortal Combat.

As you can see the difference between them can be so huge and totally unrelated.

There is one symptom that always comes with a game when it makes people addictive.
It is not an indicator, but it is usually the case.

A lot of expansion keeps coming out. Like the people play the game, not enough, I want more, and more.

Addictive is created, when the fundamental, the logic of the game play, matches right into the personality of a human being. 

Personality perhaps not a suitable word of using it. It is like a group personality what it is meant here. Like a similar behavior, pattern and preference that shared by a group of people.

One person, can play a lot of games in his life. But what makes him addictive to it, are always, only a few.

That is what addictive means.

I have seen people very committed to Farm Villa, I can see they are addicting to it, but I could not get why that game can be so addictive to them. 

The same as well, they could not understand why I am addictive to a particular game as well.

But there is one thing that can be noticed.

We both do not share preferences in many ways.

That means our personalities are quite different.

When a fundamental of a game can hit into a gamer's heart and makes him addict to it, that just mean you have hit his personality.

There are people who likes bloods and heads cutting off in games.
There are people who like sexy images in games.

There are people who like complexity in games.

There are people who like cute things in games.

There are people who like simulations in games.

There are people who like building stuffs in games.

Players who gets really, really addictive to certain games, usually their personality, are quite similar. If you do not believe it, you can go and see for it.

So this is addictive. What comes the mind occupy?

Mind occupied, is a sort of phenomena, that comes from many aspects. (I am not sure if I can describe this last part myself, because it is hard for me to put it in an elaboration of words) 

It can be visual. It can be the sound effect. It can be the game play. It can be complexity. Heck, I could get addicted to a game just because of its background music.

A mind occupied factor, is like a missing part, to an object, that with its present, it makes the object shines.

It can be a factor of strengthening. Balancing. Cons-countering.

So for a simple word to describe that is. An object, is already shining. But with the missing part comes it, it makes it shine even more.

Or an object, that is unable to shine that much, with its present, it could shine even more.

One is merely strengthening. One is countering its weakness so it could shine.

Let's take an example.

A horror movie.

The frightening looking. The sudden appearing and vanishing. The scream. Is what parts of a horror movie.

But when every horror movie is like that, which one makes it different?

The one who applied a character that looks very similar to the normal, average people.

So, movies, always applied handsome guy, pretty girl, with big muscle, big boobs, to run the show. 

So it is pretty hard to concentrate on the horror part. Because I need to see all the pretty faces.

Then it comes suddenly the Japanese horror movies. In some of them, the face and the look of the character, these guys are neither handsome or pretty to be noticed with, but rather looks like the kind of people that usually live around us.

So when a horror movie, when it applies the frightening effect, matched together with the sensation of something that is close to the environment you lived in, it creates fear in you, because the environment already drags you into it.

So you could understand why it is hard to be elaborated in words.

Same in games, a mind occupied, is an effect, that either negates you from the existing disturbance, or enhance your sensation, so you could get even concentrated to the game, that you already addicted in it.

Addicted and concentration, makes a mind occupied.

I don't actually want to reveal what kind of game that makes me addicted and mind occupied, as that lead to my personality to open in the public.

But I can give an example, of how is it looks like.

So let us take Sim City as an example. A lot of people like Sim City.

It is a simulation of building games. You get to build the things until you formed something big up. That is the joy of simulation building games.

So one day. Someone made a history.

Minecraft.

Is Minecraft more addicting than Sim City? Of course. Why so?

Minecraft has a key, that Sim City doesn't have. It minimize the size of the fundamental to build something. A brick, for example.

So, when you play Sim City, you has all the prepared roads, buildings, innovations prepared, all you need is to plan where to put it.

So what could you do with a brick?

A brick, is one tiny piece of source, that could be built into anything you want. Flexibility.

So there are a lot of simulation games running around, get people addicted.

City.
Airplane.

Ships.

Buildings.

Each one of its kind.

Minecraft has the brick. It can cover all the said simulation above. A city, airplane, ship and buildings can all be built, start with a single brick.

So not everyone who can find the missing part. But when you can, it is destiny that you could be very succeed in the game you make.